Re: List rules, was:[ga] Increased foreign attendance

[Jeff Williams <jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Debbie and all,

  Anyone can "Declair" a consensus even when one does not exist.
A consensus must be measured to be accurate and valid when making
rules or determining policies that effect many and many more whom
have yet to be involved or even aware.  In other words, Trust
but always verify.

  A general assembly votes.  We can vote on list or off, I really
don't care.  We can also do both, vote on list and off list, for those
whom are squeamish or choose to have a private ballot.  I respect
to a very great degree, everyone's privacy, don't you??  A public
vote sometimes puts a person in a very odd position and opens
him/her up for harassment, ridicule, and sometimes very dangerous
actions.  These are reasons why in America, our very wise founding
fathers insisted of a private ballot as is so in many other freedom
loving countries.  Therefore my original requirement stands.

  Given the length of this thread, as an aside, I believe Dr. Dierker
is stalling or Glen and Kent are also stalling. And please, I recognize
procedural gymnastic tactics when I hear them or read them.  By
now even a millipede would have exhausted itself in the exercising.

Debbie Garside wrote:

> Hi Jeff
>
> Within other forums that I frequent we generally do not have a vote.  Rather
> the Chair of the list ascertains consensus on an issue from those who post
> on the topic.  I cannot see why the GA list cannot do the same.  Not all
> people wish to be identified and not all wish to be vocal.  However, if they
> are subscribed to the list and they see that consensus is going against
> their views they will, most likely, say something and thus form part of the
> process.  If they say nothing they obviously do not feel it is of importance
> to them or do not understand the topic well enough to form an opinion.  I
> don't see how having the list of email addresses will change this.
>
> Best regards
>
> Debbie
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-ga@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > [mailto:owner-ga@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jeff Williams
> > Sent: 04 July 2007 07:13
> > To: Hugh Dierker
> > Cc: General Assembly of the DNSO
> > Subject: Re: List rules, was:[ga] Increased foreign attendance
> >
> > Dr. Dierker and all,
> >
> >   I see from you did not understand properly.  So I must now
> > take the role of the disciplinarian teacher, with you as the
> > errant student.  I had hoped this would not be necessary. >:(
> >
> > My request is a necessity, not an option.  No eMail addresses
> > no drafting of list rules by me, as such an exercise must
> > have the approval of the members now subscribed.
> >
> >   I will not engage in any exercises that does not have a
> > reasonable chance of being actually and accurately voted on
> > by ALL willing and subscribed members of the GA.  Been there
> > with Kent, Harold and Roberto, and I am not ever going there again.
> >
> > Hugh Dierker wrote:
> >
> > >    Jeff,
> > >
> > >   If you have a request for something regarding this list the
> > > appropriate method would be to ask me. I am quite aware that due to
> > > privacy matters a list of members and their email addresses is
> > > unavailable. I respect that and will hammer no one to
> > violate anothers
> > > privacy. Within these confines I am sure you can draft
> > rules. I am not
> > > asking you to accomplish the voting on them. Hence a task force.
> > > Simply report back.
> > >
> > >   I did give a start date of the 4th of July. You are premature as
> > > there may be objections or other volunteers.
> > >
> > >   Thank you for you enthusiasm.
> > >
> > >   Eric
> > >
> > > Jeff Williams <jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > >   Debbie and all,
> > >
> > > I responded to your question on this already, but wanted to
> > add that
> > > maybe Kent or Glen can give us a more accurate answer? I also would
> > > like to have the Email addresses of all of he currently
> > subscribed so
> > > I can help meet Dr. Dierkers request regarding suggested
> > revised list
> > > rules so we can vote on them in a democratic fashion. Without those
> > > Email addresses, I cannot meet Dr. Dierkers request. Glen?
> > Kent? How
> > > about it?
> > >
> > > Note: Dr. Dierker, chair, I am attempting to meet your request,
> > > However you should be hammering Kent and Glen offlist for this
> > > information and
> > >
> > > should have been doing so long before now. Be advised, I am
> > only going
> > >
> > > to make this request this ONE time! Failure to meet my
> > request is not
> > > workable result to meet your request for obvious reasons. I
> > will NOT
> > > play catch 22 games here! Is that clear?
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > --
> > Jeffrey A. Williams
> > Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 134k members/stakeholders
> > strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" -
> >    Abraham Lincoln
> >
> > "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with
> > what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt
> >
> > "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the
> > burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L
> > multiplied by
> > P: i.e., whether B is less than PL."
> > United States v. Carroll Towing  (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947]
> > ===============================================================
> > Updated 1/26/04
> > CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security
> > IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng.  INEG. INC.
> > ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail
> > jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx  Registered Email addr with the USPS
> > Contact Number: 214-244-4827
> >
> >
> >
> >

Regards,

--
Jeffrey A. Williams
Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 134k members/stakeholders strong!)
"Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" -
   Abraham Lincoln

"Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is
very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt

"If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B;
liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by
P: i.e., whether B is less than PL."
United States v. Carroll Towing  (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947]
===============================================================
Updated 1/26/04
CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security
IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng.  INEG. INC.
ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402
E-Mail jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
 Registered Email addr with the USPS
Contact Number: 214-244-4827