Re: [ga] FW: Fee for disproportionate deletes in proposed .biz contract

[Jeff Williams <jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Veni and all former DNSO GA members or other interested stakeholders/users,

  Danny was not asking for "Guidance".  He WAS asking you Veni specific
and direct questions regarding proposed .biz contract on this thread.

Veni Markovski wrote:

> At 12:12 PM 03.8.2006 '?.'  -0700, Karl Auerbach wrote:
> >Veni Markovski wrote:
> >>At 03:07 AM 03.8.2006 '?.'  -0700, Karl Auerbach wrote:
> >>>Veni Markovski wrote:
> >>>>Danny,
> >>>>1. The proper channel to ask ICANN questions about its
> >>>>activities, is through the Chair of the Board, or the President.
> >>>>
> >>>>2. Asking individual directors for their "guidance" is not the
> >>>>right way to deal with an organization.
> >>>
> >>>I don't know where you got these incorrect ideas.
> >>Karl,
> >>we have difference of opinions on that, and I believe it's a good sign.
> >
> >I'm talking about the legal rights and duties of directors as
> >provided and demanded by law.
> >
> >If a director has some sort of feeling that there is an "etiquitte"
> >of some kind that prevents him or her from undertaking those duties
> >or meeting those obligations than that director should seriously
> >consider resigning.
>
> It seems you misread me. The difference of opinion is that I don't
> think my ideas are incorrect.  What you just wrote above is pretty
> much into my undersanding of the duties of directors. But I don't see
> anything in the bylaws about directors giving "guidance" to Danny, or
> anyone, except through a proper process.
>
> >>>It is indeed sad that many ICANN directors seem to believe that
> >>>their only source of information is that which is force fed to
> >>>them by ICANN's staff.
> >>I don't know why you believe they believe that.
> >
> >Experience from being on the board and observation of subsequent directors.
>
> Well, when you say "many... directors ... seem to believe..." that is
> not about the time when you were on the Board, or you'd have used
> past tense, right? That's why I said that I am not sure why you
> believe the current directors believe that. In your current response,
> you again point back in time.
>
> >>>Furthermore, it would be inappropriate for a corporation (ICANN)
> >>>to require that communication with any given director pass through
> >>>another director or executive officer.
> >>Oh, no, no... Disagree completely. I never said that communication
> >>with any DIRECTOR should pass through another director - be that
> >>the chair, or through the CEO. I am talking about communication
> >>with the organization.
> >
> >So you feel that ICANN ought to require that all information be
> >received by a designated channel the receipt of information, digest
> >it, and then hand the pre-digested material to a director?
>
> Why are you putting words in my mouth? I am just saying, that if
> someone wants a response from an organization, he or she should
> address the organization. E.g. when someone sends a letter or a fax,
> they will be stamped "received at...", and will enter into a database
> system to be properly handled.
>
> >If you or any other director choses to accept only such information
> >as may be fed to you via staff and "proper channels" than that
> >director is failing in his/her duty to make decisions that are both
> >informed and independent.
>
> Karl, now you are talking about accepting information. Danny was
> refering to obtaining from me the opinion of ICANN. Let's put some
> order here. I want and I have always received information through
> different channels. But I am not ICANN. I don't represent ICANN, and
> e-mails to me can not serve as officially informing ICANN on anything.
>
> >>>Moreover, directors are not permitted to simply rely on
> >>>conclusions made by other, people - under California law - which
> >>>governs every ICANN director - directors are permitted to rely on
> >>>the conclusions of only a very few  types of people - such as
> >>>accountants.  In all other cases each director much gather data,
> >>>examine it, and reach his or her own independent decision.
> >>And again - if you go to the records of the Board minutes, you will
> >>see that in some of the most heated debates, directors have not
> >>"simply relied" on these.
> >
> >Yeah right.  ICANN's published meetings of board discussions are
> >nearly empty of real debate.
>
> I don't agree. The .xxx and the .com are pretty full, and if you see
> what people are debating - exactly those topics.
>
> >>While I don't understand why you say "many" (and indeed don't know
> >>how you define "many"), I can speak for myself, and the minutes
> >>from our public meetings show explicit desire to engage in real
> >>discussion with the public.
> >
> >Really?  I have *never* seen any real discussion between board
> >members or of board members with the public at any board meeting since I left.
>
> Would you like to go through the minutes? I remember what I said.
>
> >Have you read the various academic works about auction and lottery
> >systems for new TLDs?  Have you read the discussions on the various
> >grace periods and their use in 5-day domain speculation?   Have you
> >read the discussions on the relationship of registry cost to ICANN's
> >fiat registry fee?  etc etc  Do you even read some of the good
> >summaries, such as appear on Circle-ID?
>
> If you take a look at the time I've spent on this board, you'd find
> out that I have read more than necessary.
>
> >It would be wrong to characterize that vast body of work to be
> >merely "complaints" - yes there are complaints - but there are also
> >many well considered answers.
>
> It would be equallyt to characterize "many" of the directors as
> whatever-you-said-above.
>
> >Why are you not seeing or hearing these?
>
> Probably because they are not being heard well on this list? The
> problem is the vocal people occupy space, and the ones who can
> actually contribute often are left behind.
>
> veni

Regards,

--
Jeffrey A. Williams
Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 134k members/stakeholders strong!)
"Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" -
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very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt

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