Re: [ga] Call for Elimination of AGP

[<chris@xxxxxx>]

We agree on all points there. I know you added the oversight part by ICANN's 
staff. I only ignored that part because ICANN's staff will also ignore it.
Chris McElroy, NameCritic, Inc.
http://www.seoserviceprovider.com

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <ga@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: <twomey@xxxxxxxxx>; <avri@xxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 1:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ga] Call for Elimination of AGP


> Chris and all,
>
>  Of course.  And this scenerio will not likely change
> much by technical means alone which is WHY I suggested
> additionally that oversite 24/7 by ICANN staff as well
> as policy that prohibits such errant nonsense to prevent
> Tasting be strictly enforced.  That being if Registries
> and Registrars don't police their operations, than they
> loose their accreditation. <full stop>
>
>  Playing "Lets make a deal" so to speak will never
> suffice for long, if at all initially.
>
>  Danny said it right, if ICANN doesn't do it's
> duty, than governments will and some already have
> started to do so.  Government regulation will commence
> in ernest if ICANN continues to do a lack luster job
> of controling it's registries and registrars appropriately.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> > From: chris@xxxxxx
> > Sent: Mar 28, 2008 9:30 PM
> > To: jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx, ga@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Cc: twomey@xxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: Re: [ga] Call for Elimination of AGP
> >
> >
> > It will work like antivirus works. You make a program that detects and
> > removes viruses and they write new viruses. You write or build security 
> > into
> > your server and hackers find another way to get it. You technically try to
> > block scripts and techniques used by kiters and tasters and they write new
> > ones. The only difference being that ICANN and the registries will never
> > work as hard to keep the new viruses (Taster techniques) from working as 
> > the
> > antivirus people do with viruses.
> >
> > Chris McElroy, NameCritic, Inc.
> > http://www.articlecontentprovider.com
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: <jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > To: <ga@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Cc: <twomey@xxxxxxxxx>
> > Sent: Friday, March 28, 2008 5:30 PM
> > Subject: Re: [ga] Call for Elimination of AGP
> >
> >
> > > Chris and all,
> > >
> > >  Of course what you suggest is indeed possible and
> > > perhaps likely.  But do we really know that?  I
> > > am not sure we do.  What we do know given the history
> > > of poor oversight by ICANN staff, is that registrars
> > > and registries will do whatever they wish with reletive
> > > impunity unless ICANN takes direct, immediate and at times
> > > drastic action such as  suspension or revocation of
> > > Accreditation.  If such was enforced a few times, I
> > > have little doubt that the technically avaliable solutions
> > > will work just fine.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: chris@xxxxxx
> > > > Sent: Mar 28, 2008 10:19 AM
> > > > To: jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx, ga@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > Subject: Re: [ga] Call for Elimination of AGP
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > And for every limitation, they will create a workaround as with
> > > > everything.
> > > >
> > > > Chris McElroy
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > > > From: <jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > To: <ga@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2008 6:42 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: [ga] Call for Elimination of AGP
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Ross and all,
> > > > >
> > > > >  I agree that eliminating the AGP isn't necessary, but
> > > > > niether is limiting it to 24 hrs.  A technical registration
> > > > > software fix to disregard script registration attempts
> > > > > and tracking multipul registrations transactions from the
> > > > > same registrant as well as limiting the number of domain
> > > > > name registrations per transaction to a fixed number, say
> > > > > 10, would do the trick IMO.
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: Ross Rader <ross@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > Sent: Mar 27, 2008 12:46 PM
> > > > > > To: chris@xxxxxx
> > > > > > Cc: John Palmer <jpalmer@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, ga@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [ga] Call for Elimination of AGP
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I think eliminating it is pretty harsh, but I agree with most of your
> > > > > > concerns with the current proposals. My preference would instead be to
> > > > > > limit the AGP to a very short period (i.e. less than 24 hours) so that
> > > > > > mistakes can still be fixed, but that the potential for abuse is kept
> > > > > > to an absolute minimum. Mistakes do happen, and speaking as someone
> > > > > > who inadvertently let loose a test script on the registry and
> > > > > > registered hundreds of useless names, I would like to keep the
> > > > > > potential to fix these types of mistakes when they occasionally
> > > > > > happen. I'm less concerned about fraud because this is something that
> > > > > > we can actively control through tight monitoring and screening of
> > > > > > credit cards, etc.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Mar 27, 2008, at 3:05 PM, <chris@xxxxxx> <chris@xxxxxx> wrote:
> > > > > > > So do I. I think I hear a consensus stampeding toward us. Of course
> > > > > > > this is just a bottom up consensus which ICANN has repeatedly
> > > > > > > ignored in the past.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Chris McElroy
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > > From: John Palmer
> > > > > > > To: ga@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > > Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2008 11:27 AM
> > > > > > > Subject: Re: [ga] Call for Elimination of AGP
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I have yet to hear of a valid reason for domain tasting. Karl is
> > > > > > > correct. There should not be any refunds for domain
> > > > > > > registrations at all for people who are repeat offenders. There
> > > > > > > isn't any place for this nonsense as
> > > > > > > it takes up valuable resources that no one gets paid for.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I support the call for elimination of the AGP as well.
> > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > > From: Karl Peters - TLDA
> > > > > > > To: Dominik Filipp
> > > > > > > Cc: domain-tasting-motion@xxxxxxxxx ; ga@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > > Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2008 11:16 AM
> > > > > > > Subject: Re: [ga] Call for Elimination of AGP
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >        I heartily second the "call for Elimination of AGP" as posted
> > > > > > > by Dominik Filipp and for reasons explained on the GA list in  the
> > > > > > > past week and for reasons not yet even enumerated. No one has yet
> > > > > > > spotlighted even one PROPER use of the domain tasting by a major
> > > > > > > corporation in market study and the arguments for protection of
> > > > > > > registrars from credit card fraud and the like are no more
> > > > > > > compelling that ANY internet sales related company's difficulty.
> > > > > > > Registrars who can not handle the business should drop out of it, as
> > > > > > > in any other industry. What makes them special?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > -Karl E. Peters
> > > > > Regards,
> > > > >
> > > > > Jeffrey A. Williams
> > > > > Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 277k members/stakeholders strong!)
> > > > > "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" -
> > > > >   Abraham Lincoln
> > > > >
> > > > > "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is 
> > > > > very
> > > > > often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt
> > > > >
> > > > > "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B;
> > > > > liability
> > > > > depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by
> > > > > P: i.e., whether B is less than PL."
> > > > > United States v. Carroll Towing  (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947]
> > > > > ===============================================================
> > > > > Updated 1/26/04
> > > > > CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. 
> > > > > div.
> > > > > of
> > > > > Information Network Eng.  INEG. INC.
> > > > > ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail
> > > > > jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > Phone: 214-244-4827
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > Jeffrey A. Williams
> > > Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 277k members/stakeholders strong!)
> > > "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" -
> > >   Abraham Lincoln
> > >
> > > "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very
> > > often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt
> > >
> > > "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B;
> > > liability
> > > depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by
> > > P: i.e., whether B is less than PL."
> > > United States v. Carroll Towing  (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947]
> > > ===============================================================
> > > Updated 1/26/04
> > > CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div.
> > > of
> > > Information Network Eng.  INEG. INC.
> > > ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail
> > > jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > Phone: 214-244-4827
> Regards,
>
> Jeffrey A. Williams
> Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 277k members/stakeholders strong!)
> "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" -
>   Abraham Lincoln
>
> "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very
> often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt
>
> "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; 
> liability
> depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by
> P: i.e., whether B is less than PL."
> United States v. Carroll Towing  (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947]
> ===============================================================
> Updated 1/26/04
> CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. 
> of
> Information Network Eng.  INEG. INC.
> ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail 
> jwkckid1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Phone: 214-244-4827