RE: [council] Point for Discussion
- To: <ross@xxxxxxxxxx>, "Mike Rodenbaugh" <mxr@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Subject: RE: [council] Point for Discussion
- From: "Gomes, Chuck" <cgomes@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 15:53:13 -0400
- Cc: "GNSO Council" <council@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- In-reply-to: <4697D4EE.email@example.com>
- Sender: owner-council@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Thread-index: AcfFhqDkGsxnnHMZQMi7/I8zto+EzgAALyDQ
- Thread-topic: [council] Point for Discussion
That might be okay. But what happens if you are unavailable; wouldn't a
communication from an RC officer be useful.
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> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-council@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:owner-council@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ross Rader
> Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 3:39 PM
> To: Mike Rodenbaugh
> Cc: GNSO Council
> Subject: Re: [council] Point for Discussion
> Except I don't agree that that consultation with the
> constituency is required or necessary. I would prefer that
> dealing with these details be left to each constituency to
> sort out. For instance, I'm required to represent the
> interests and positions of my constituency, and subject to
> recall provisions when the membership feels that I don't.
> This extends to all of my formal council activities,
> including my (former) use of proxies. I don't know if some
> form of check or double-check is important if we instead rely
> on constituency self-determination to manage their council
> rep relationships.
> Mike Rodenbaugh wrote:
> > I agree with Ross and Chuck on this point:
> > constituency should not be penalized because [a Councilor] has a
> > conflict of interest, as long as there is simple
> confirmation from an
> > officer of his constituency that they have taken a specific position
> > Mike Rodenbaugh
> > Sr. Legal Director
> > Yahoo! Inc.
> > NOTE: This message may be protected by attorney-client and/or work
> > product privileges, if you are not the intended recipient
> then please
> > delete this message and all attachments and notify me as soon as
> > possible. Thanks.
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-council@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > [mailto:owner-council@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> > On Behalf Of Gomes, Chuck
> > Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 11:23 AM
> > To: Avri Doria; GNSO Council
> > Subject: RE: [council] Point for Discussion
> > I seriously wonder whether the writers of the Bylaws
> intended that a
> > Council representative could vote however he/she pleased
> regardless of
> > a constituency position, so it seems to me that this should
> be fixed
> > in the Bylaws. I agree with Ross that his constituency
> should not be
> > penalized because he has a conflict of interest as long as their
> > simple confirmation from an officer of his constituency
> that they have
> > taken a specific position. The intent of my original
> suggestion was
> > to deal with situations like this.
> > Chuck Gomes
> > "This message is intended for the use of the individual or
> entity to
> > which it is addressed, and may contain information that is
> > confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. Any
> > unauthorized use, distribution, or disclosure is strictly
> > If you have received this message in error, please notify sender
> > immediately and destroy/delete the original transmission."
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: owner-council@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> [mailto:owner-council@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Avri Doria
> >> Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 1:19 PM
> >> To: GNSO Council
> >> Subject: Re: [council] Point for Discussion
> >> On 13 jul 2007, at 12.47, Ross Rader wrote:
> >>> Avri Doria wrote:
> >>>> I also favor an approach that includes a prohibition
> >> against using a
> >>>> proxy mechanism to avoid a required abstention based on a
> >> conflict of
> >>>> interest.
> >>> Why?
> >> On the basis of a basic fairness issue.
> >> My expectation is that everyone may at some point face a vote on
> >> which they have a conflict that would force an abstention.
> >> In the event that someone is a nomcom appointee or from a
> >> constituency that does not use a constituency discipline method of
> >> internal organization, it makes sense that they would not
> be allowed
> >> to use the proxy to avoid the need to abstain. So, for me
> it follows
> >> from a general non-prejudicial principle that, as I indicated, no
> >> constituency be given an advantage based on their organizational
> >> practice or methodology.
> >>> My interests and those of my constituency can be different. For
> >>> instance, I have conflicts related to my employment with
> >> Tucows that
> >>> other councillors may not share. Why should that prevent
> >> the registrar
> >>> constituency from casting one of its ballots through proxy?
> >> I guess the actual question is who do the ballots belong to?
> >> I read the following by-laws as relevant:
> >> x.3.1 the GNSO Council shall consist of three representatives
> >> selected by each of the Constituencies described in
> Section 5 of this
> >> Article, and three persons selected by the ICANN Nominating
> >> Committee.
> >> X.3.8(b) all members are provided the means of fully
> participating in
> >> all matters before the GNSO Council, and (c) ICANN adopts and
> >> implements means of verifying that (x) a person
> participating in such
> >> a meeting is a member of the GNSO Council or other person
> entitled to
> >> participate in the meeting and (y) all actions of, or
> votes by, the
> >> GNSO Council are taken or cast only by the members of the GNSO
> >> Council and not persons who are not members.
> >> X.5.2. The number of votes that members of the GNSO
> Council may cast
> >> shall be equalized so that the aggregate number of votes of
> >> representatives selected by the Constituencies (currently the gTLD
> >> Registries and Registrars) that are under contract with ICANN
> >> obligating them to implement ICANN-adopted policies is
> equal to the
> >> number of votes of representatives selected by other
> >> I read this as stating that:
> >> - a constituency can pick 3 members of council
> >> - those council members, and only those council members have a
> >> right to vote.
> >> - the RyC and RC council members each have 2 votes
> >> My reading indicates that while the constituency picks the
> >> it is the members who have the vote and not the constituencies. I
> >> believe it is totally acceptable practice for a
> constituency to place
> >> requirements on how its representatives vote, but I do not
> see that
> >> as meaning that they, therefore, control the votes in
> council, though
> >> they do control the seating of the councilor.
> >>> As a general rule, I'd really prefer if we adopted a very
> >> simple set
> >>> of rules governing the use of proxy's, and would strongly
> >> prefer if we
> >>> just implemented the old rules as starting point that we
> >> could adjust
> >>> over time. I don't see a need to overthink or overengineer
> >> this simply
> >>> to take into account "what-if's" that have never come into
> >> play during
> >>> the history of the DNSO/GNSO.
> >> I agree with the general rule of making the simplest
> possible change.
> >> However, in this case, I think we would need a much larger
> change to
> >> the by-laws to accommodate your suggestion, which of course we can
> >> discuss doing. Additonally since the concern about the
> >> of use of proxy to get around the abstention requirement has been
> >> brought up in regard to proxy voting, I believe we have to
> >> that in any proposed changes to the by-laws.
> >> thanks
> >> a.
> Ross Rader
> Director, Retail Services
> Tucows Inc.
> t. 416.538.5492